Georgia: Art, Protest and the Struggle for Freedom

00:00:02: What happens to art when democracy comes under pressure?

00:00:05: And what happens to our texts, from the institutions that are supposed to enable and protect art after themselves co-opted politically.

00:00:13: Georgia has undergone dramatic political developments in recent years.

00:00:18: The ruling Georgian Green Party had been in power since two thousand twelve Massive protests erupted following the controversial twenty-twenty four parliamentary elections and the government's decision to effectively suspend EU accession negotiations.

00:00:36: At the same time, media, NGOs and civil society organizations are coming under increasing pressure.

00:00:43: Welcome to Blickwexel – The VIDC Podcast or a different view on the role.

00:00:47: My name is Sibyla Straubinger And my podcast focuses on international topics.

00:01:06: Today we will discuss the authoritarian developments in Georgia and their impact on civil society, particularly on cultural practitioners.

00:01:16: My guest today is the Georgian filmmaker & video artist Salome Yashi who'll also be participating in a discussion of artistic freedom on September thirteenth organized by Kudur Niverdegung, the VIDC's Cultural Initiatives.

00:01:32: Salome welcome to Blikbexel!

00:01:35: So when you look at Georgia from the outside, do you see a country that for many years was strongly oriented towards Europe and is now taking an increasingly authoritarian and your skeptic course.

00:01:49: How would explain to someone who only knows in Georgia from news what has happened in recent years?

00:01:57: Well anyway... You said something I can also answer.

00:02:02: Georgia, from being an increasingly democratic country has suddenly become and increasing the authoritarian country.

00:02:10: And this shift was very fast as you said after twenty-twenty four elections mainly after they wore the full scale invasion of Russia to Ukraine in two hundred twenty one when Georgia took a more pro Russian Russia alike stands.

00:02:26: And what did you personally realize?

00:02:28: that?

00:02:28: it wasn't just the political rhetoric, but also the space for people who disagree?

00:02:35: I think politics and social life is very much connected.

00:02:39: Especially in Georgia...I mean, elsewhere as well everywhere in the world!

00:02:43: But in Georgia, the political decisions define the cultural lives of society.

00:02:49: And that was especially when the government, the Ministry of Culture started to target cultural institutions.

00:02:58: That it became very obvious... ...that the work of us as cultural practitioners is becoming very difficult.

00:03:07: So you experienced this development early on from a unique perspective and namely through your film Taming The Garden?

00:03:16: The film tells the story of a billionaire who has massive, sometimes sensory old trees from various parts of Georgia dug out and transported to his private estates.

00:03:28: And you turn this into a story about power ownership, uprooting and control.

00:03:33: So what initially interested you?

00:03:36: About the story and very already aware back then Of how strongly the film would be interpreted as political metaphor.

00:03:45: Well, first maybe I should say that the person or the billionaire who we have in Georgia.

00:03:50: We have a billionaire called Pizzi Naivanishvili and Oligard Who rules the country?

00:03:56: He does not really hold any official power.

00:03:59: he was a prime minister.

00:04:00: In twenty twelve.

00:04:02: he founded The Georgian Dream Party.

00:04:04: That has this like funny name but it's still is still in dominant Power until now And here has been the shadow ruler since then.

00:04:12: The government, the members of governments are coming from his previous entourage.

00:04:16: for example Minister Of Health was his former dentist.

00:04:21: The minister of internal affairs at some point he's a former bodyguard.

00:04:26: so it is people in the government that are his loyals.

00:04:30: He has been famous for his exquisite hobbies, like he... As we heard of him by twenty-twelve was that he collects penguins.

00:04:38: He collects sharks.

00:04:40: He collect expensive and infamous pieces of art.

00:04:44: so that's when I and we in Georgia heard That he is collecting large massive hundred year old trees.

00:04:53: And the first time When they were the first tree was uprooted from the shore From the coastline of Georgia And then it was put on big trucks and slid onto land, then swam in the sea to reach his estate.

00:05:09: The scene of this tree swimming is probably one or most impressive things I have ever seen not just because a tree swimming as visual experience which was interesting but triggered The emotions i had never perceived it could trigger like its.

00:05:30: for me this the scene of tree swimming in the sea spoke about a massive desire.

00:05:35: it spoke about uprooting his book about.

00:05:38: Loneliness about the exercise of power the possibility of impossibility the migration and uh... and these first image made me think that I want to make a film explore what is behind this so-called but i called at the time glitch glitching reality which slowly, became the reality in Georgia.

00:05:58: And it was actually last year, eight years after I had been working on a film that I myself realized that I was one of those trees uprooted from my own land just like many other people in Georgia.

00:06:13: So the film was made with great acclaim internationally but at the same time its screening in Georgia was restricted by cinemas and ultimately heralded by the Film Academy.

00:06:25: So, politicians attacked the film until personally as well.

00:06:30: How did that affect you?

00:06:32: What had it made with

00:06:33: you?".

00:06:34: Well yeah... As you said we could not release the film in cinemas and there was no big screen for the film really.

00:06:41: It was publicly criticised by government including a person who is currently the Prime Minister or the Minister of Culture Of The Time And how I felt about it.

00:06:55: I mean, it has two sides.

00:06:56: On the one hand there was beautiful experience in this sense that i felt a huge support of the public and huge interest of the Public In The Film.

00:07:06: So we then screened the film in multiple so-called what would call now underground spaces which are NGO Spaces Which became Underground Spaces suddenly or independent theatres like small scale theatres independent, like some cafe yards or something.

00:07:25: Unlikely spaces.

00:07:26: so for two months almost every day there were screenings and it was full many people coming in.

00:07:31: It's not just watching a film but an act of solidarity For the film And freedom of expression culture.

00:07:43: So that had huge positive impact on me And I think it did create this act of solidarity and an act coming together.

00:07:52: Then on the other hand, of course... It is an unsettling experience when a man in power publicly criticizes or targets the film for himself And understanding that those people in power, they walk with bodyguards.

00:08:08: They have all the power in their lives and I am a single mother living in an apartment that can be very easily reached by a stone that somebody might throw into my window.

00:08:18: so that's inequality and imbalance did feel quite unsettling.

00:08:23: I wouldn't say frightening because i don't think it is about being afraid but rather not being comfortable about it.

00:08:30: Yeah understandable you see this the year, twenty-twenty two was a decisive turning point.

00:08:37: The leadership and staff of various cultural institutions were replaced by people close to

00:08:42: government.".

00:08:43: So I think what does this mean for artists when they're institutions that are supposed to enable in abandoned culture politically controls?

00:08:54: Yeah well i should say first off all that Georgian government or Georgian state has never really cared about culture before.

00:09:04: I mean, there was some public funding available which is still joined.

00:09:07: Georgia called the State Funding and right so because it has always been more or less controlled by this central government with no arms length between artists and institutions in the central government but For work.

00:09:27: I mean, for example in film there was some funding which is never a lot of public fundings but it's always good starting point to start making the film and then find other partners and collaborators and funders.

00:09:43: And from late twenty-twenty two that when we realized as filmmakers We lost the George National Film Center Which Is The Only Funding Abode What It Means Basically Our work, our workflow so to say becomes much more difficult because there is no other funding opportunity in the country.

00:10:02: And that we start... We started to become totally dependent on international funding schemes and not just for filmmakers but of all other art forms in Georgia.

00:10:15: Just jump ahead a little bit.

00:10:17: So as I said in twenty-twenty two the Georgian public funding became inaccessible And then from last year, because of the laws that government passed even international funding has become inaccessible for Georgian artists but also all kinds of civil lectures.

00:10:35: Not just inaccessable but criminalized and we can speak more about this

00:10:40: as well.

00:10:41: Do you automatically stop censoring yourself?

00:10:45: So if no one directly tells what your allowed to say or not allow it Is this something you start automatically in some way?

00:10:58: That is a very good question and that can be discussed at length.

00:11:04: But I think, it really depends...I mean i can give an example just recently one month ago as stand-up comedian Oni Sokriashvili was targeted first by pro governmental media through huge smear campaign and then he was physically attacked.

00:11:22: And that happened because as a comedian, Ironically one of the leading Georgian writers, but it was not a straightforward criticism.

00:11:36: It was part of their comedy so to say.

00:11:39: But there's this state-owned media and they government controlled media I used is against him because he has been very abit supporter of the protestant very evident criticizer Of The Government And he eventually had to flee the country He's in exile currently.

00:11:54: So looking at these I mean here you didn't think she didn't self censor himself.

00:11:59: But when you are an artist and think that this can potentially happen to one, well how do you act?

00:12:07: Are you courageous enough to take risk... ...and continue your work or do you automatically start to compromise yourself?

00:12:15: And they're just words!

00:12:17: I myself have had times where should i say it like this.. Or even if we speak with friends sometimes outside in a cafe at the public space At some point we realized, when start to speak with a quiet voice.

00:12:33: We don't use certain words which you think might be identified by someone sitting next us and could potentially used against us.

00:12:41: So it is... I think if we know consciously that we are censoring ourselves for some reason It's fine.

00:12:49: but also this situation affects the mind And it is highly possible that we start self-sensory, of course.

00:12:56: But this is something we need to be aware off.

00:12:59: Yeah That's terrible and happened in so many countries

00:13:03: at the moment.

00:13:04: yeah So with mainly been talking about you and about the film scene.

00:13:09: but as you already mentioned The political changes in Georgia go far beyond that.

00:13:14: So NGOs, journalists activists and other parts of civil society also under increasing pressure.

00:13:21: People are being arrested, as you said.

00:13:23: Finally find heavily or physically attacked organizations of being shut down for having their assets

00:13:31: frozen.".

00:13:32: So how do we perceive the overall situation of Georgian civil society?

00:13:37: Is there still a strong counter-movement despite increasing pressure

00:13:43: on me?

00:13:43: when they were just listing all these and asking questions I had to chill us out my back honestly because I think in these last two years have been very intense, especially the last year.

00:13:55: And what I realized recently more and more is that we started to adapt.

00:14:00: Adapt meaning it's not to adopt a situation but overall in this country or to adapt into our state because we lived in highly alert mode last year.

00:14:12: considering some of our acquaintances are people who know us.

00:14:19: Ordinary people are in jail for no particular reason.

00:14:21: For example, we have an actor in jail who's basically my colleague or has a journalist in jail and then multiple times there had been teachers or lawyers... I don't know like medics in jail but it is obvious that they're for not any particular reasons because of the political act until this fact.

00:14:43: And also some activists have been heavily fined tens of thousands, or dozens of thousands of euros.

00:14:53: And because that day for example they needed to sell their apartment so the government would not take it away and some people cannot manage their bank accounts.

00:15:06: if they have a bank account then the government might take money from them.

00:15:09: It's like something made cannot possess.

00:15:12: So yeah in this sense last year has been very intense but I think what we've learned is We continue to live and fight through other means.

00:15:23: What I've discovered with my friends not recently but even last year is that working, doing your work has become part of resistance And this might sound absurd for the audience.

00:15:36: in Austria For example what we do some people can be considered if needed a criminal act.

00:15:46: It can be, I mean maybe this is like to an exaggeration because i don't want to say that im doing something against the law.

00:15:53: But the laws are very strange.

00:15:54: they can be adopted into multiple situations.

00:15:58: for example receiving international financing as mentioned earlier you can end up four years in jail but the law speaks about it so vague and it can be interpreted in a multiple ways It's impossible to know what will happen in reality.

00:16:19: And they think also that this law is hardly ever or almost never practiced until now, it is just hanging there.

00:16:26: so you know that last year we feel a bit calmed down?

00:16:30: So kind of... We felt maybe were not targets anymore because earlier I used lock my door but many of us would be careful.

00:16:39: I mean, some people were chased in the streets or like some people as you mentioned assets of certain NGOs largest NGOs were frozen.

00:16:48: Some heads off the NGOs are in exile.

00:16:51: so but this threat is somehow just hanging.

00:16:55: and So when-when?

00:16:57: When i work Or when i do something either myself As a filmmaker or myself as part Of an organization.

00:17:05: We know that we need to be careful That this right is all always.

00:17:08: There

00:17:11: are similarities between the strategies of cultural scene and human rights organization journalists, other parts civil society.

00:17:21: Yes absolutely we're currently in this same situation.

00:17:25: And we became into the same situation since twenty-twenty four when the prime minister and Georgian Prime Minister infamously said that we're not.

00:17:34: We are seizing the EU exertion, turning our back to EU.

00:17:39: so this society very much at that point came together.

00:17:44: The cultural actors of civil society just ordinary citizens, it was a very huge act of coming together.

00:17:53: And that was an important thing I mean we felt at the point... We are kind of fragile new society so to say since the independence in nineteen ninety one and that's what is time when we feel okay as a society with come-together under.

00:18:08: and there was a huge celebration at this same time outside of being in protest to the government policy.

00:18:14: And I think this coming together has continued since then, and i should say that like uh... Since two years already there are demonstrations every night In front of the parliament.

00:18:28: Still is crazy still every night!

00:18:30: Of course these demonstrations aren't as huge.

00:18:35: For almost one year, they were so big that it was blocking the main avenue.

00:18:41: And since then of course I mean... The energy went down and their attention shifted to other forms like work or resistance.

00:18:50: but there are people who go there every night and stand and say this is unacceptable.

00:18:57: There's a reminder we're under government controlling our country without.

00:19:03: That is not confirmed by the majority of people.

00:19:06: Maybe to come back to structures that have changed, so film community has responded to political co-optation or film funding with an unusual move.

00:19:19: about four hundred and fifty filmmakers supported the breakout of the film center decided no long apply for grants through this institution.

00:19:30: But how difficult is such a step when you need public funding?

00:19:34: And they also said before that international funding gets very much difficult and it's forbidden, nearly impossible in some ways.

00:19:45: Yes yeah... Very interesting topic.

00:19:47: I mean the boycott went into force About three years ago, it was summer and it was a huge discussion whether to go into boycott or not.

00:19:55: And finally we voted.

00:19:58: the majority of the filmmaker community at that point voted for boycotts.

00:20:03: I think it was the right step because even if could apply to financing right now We would not get it anyway.

00:20:12: The film center since then has not opened a call for documentaries For example It does not recognize documentary as a film form as documentary filmmakers, we could not get financed anyway.

00:20:24: And then for fiction yeah people could apply.

00:20:27: I mean there are some of course accommodating filmmakers or producers who do apply and get financing.

00:20:33: And they consider that cinema is not political, it's just pure cinema with all kind of politics.

00:20:40: but yeah I mean.

00:20:42: however i highly doubt this film makers would be those filmmakers have been in any way resistant to the government policy Who had being a part of demonstrations could ever be financed.

00:20:55: But also what the film center does, and that applies to other cultural institutions is it uses financial measures to control their production.

00:21:08: For example if a filmmaker changes script then they will find changing the script can be like adding a scene or some direction which could happen as part of creative process.

00:21:23: Or it can use various bureaucratic tools to control the filmmaking process or outcome, and punish filmmakers.

00:21:33: What kind of boycott actually achieve?

00:21:36: I

00:21:37: think that in this case is a statement for unity.

00:21:42: It's principle statement there are independent film makers who value their independent work who are not aligned with the authoritarian government.

00:21:55: And then there is this government and its institutions that are not welcome, I think it's a

00:22:02: statement.".

00:22:04: When we work internationally—I mean filmmakers here—it also kind of an statement that in our country Justifying or we are not representing the country which is controlled by pro-russian, anti-European and anti-democratic government.

00:22:24: So that it... It's a kind of more political statement rather than its having some benefits.

00:22:31: there are no... There is no personal benefit in this.

00:22:35: Also no change?

00:22:37: The changes that the government institutions part of the international cultural institutions anymore.

00:22:47: And that is because we have said so, and who do international festivals trust?

00:22:52: Is it filmmakers not the

00:22:54: government's?".

00:22:55: So that is the impact on boycott.

00:22:57: I think It's a statement in that sense totally matters.

00:23:04: Maybe to conclude our conversation, I would like to ask you.

00:23:08: So when your look at Georgia today in the fall of twenty-twenty six how do you assess current political situation and what we think that country stands right now?

00:23:19: And especially because i tried my podcast with a little bit hope... What gives you hope?

00:23:27: Where we are right now, just a recoup from yesterday's news.

00:23:31: We have the new Minister of Culture who comes from Parliament.

00:23:34: she was a member of parliament and has no prior experience in other fields or in culture whatsoever And construction plan for Trump Tower was announced yesterday.

00:23:46: This came into relation when some time ago George President visited Ayatollah Khamenei's funeral.

00:23:53: So this is kind of an eclectic place, which is in stagnation for me but also it's practicing a stable Russia-like policy.

00:24:03: The situation is calmer emotionally right now I think and that allows us to continue our work.

00:24:10: And what gives my hope?

00:24:11: the network was created here as part after demonstrations – the network of solidarity and understanding.

00:24:20: together we can bring change at some point.

00:24:23: That's very good, final words.

00:24:25: Thank you so much for this interesting conversation!

00:24:30: So her story illustrates that artistic freedom isn't the only threatened when a film is banned.

00:24:37: It begins to come under pressure when institutions are co-opted by politics, where people become afraid to express their opinions and when independent spaces disappear.

00:24:48: But as Salome said continuing to work can itself be a form of resistance And standing together in solidarity gives us strength.

00:24:58: Thanks for listening!

00:24:59: Have a great week.